Джордж Мартин: интервью, труды и дни


Доделал транскрипт со шведской встречи (1 часть лежит здесь, в один пост не влезло). Здесь 00:43:40 - 01:06:11.

Q: You can be as vague as you want about this question, but which character would you say is the most misunderstood?
GRRM: ...Misunderstood... Boy, I don't know, that's a tough one. I understand them all pretty well. I don't know.

EG: [???] ...from my experience, the character that's been the most misunderstood is generally Cathelyn Stark. At her relationship with John, and what it means about her behavior, what kind of person she is. That's [what?] a lot of people take issue of. She's a character that gets argued about a lot.

Q: I'm an avid bookreader, and I've followed the books and I never really got into the TV show. But I've always sort of looked on with glee whenever I see posts about shocking things that happen in the television series. And I was wondering, is the TV show going to continue beyond the books to the point where the TV show watchers get that kind of power over us readers?

GRRM: Well, you know, they may to some extent, there's no doubt about that. But on the other hand, the TV show and the books are diverging more and more. Which is of course something that I've been saying would happen for 5 years now, and yet now that it's happening people are surprised by it. I've been talking about the butterfly effect since Season 1. You know, when you introduce any change, it creates greater changes down the road. You know, you make a small change that seems insignificant and then you have to make a bigger change because you made that small change, and then you have to make a still bigger change, and pretty soon you're on completely unfamiliar territory. The show now has... God, it must be a dozen characters, maybe as many as twenty who are dead on the show but alive in the books. At first it was just one or two - you know, Mago, Irri, Jhiqui, but it's expanded season by season. Pyp, Grenn, [Pow???], well, you saw all the people who died in the last season. And this will accelerate even next season, so obviously I get a lot of characters running around in the books who are still alive and kicking and they're dead, and there's also characters like-- one of the chapters I didn't read, they're read in Frankfurt or Hamburg rather-- there already are chapters, [they're entirely?] composed of characters who don't even exist on the show - so of course there's gonna be huge differences. So you may, [say?], see some extremely shocking things on the show that come up the next season or two. But I'm not sure you can consider them spoilers, because they're never gonna happen in the books. They can't happen in the books, because the show and the books have gone down different roads.

Q: I was wondering about the medical knowledge of the Maesters in Westeros. because for example Jaime's hand, when it's treated they bring out the big guns: Quibern seems to have great knowledge of human anatomy, and so is his treatment very standard for maesters or is it exceptional that Jaime survives? Because [he was having some???] gangrene if I read it correctly.

GRRM: Well I wanted, you know... I made a deliberate decision when the book began to have the Maesters and have Westeros in general have better medical knowledge than the real life Middle ages. Mostly because I didn't want everybody dying at 26. And so it is generally improved, the Maesters have improved the standard hygiene, and they understand certain practices and they do things better. Also though, they have magic. Which doesn't always work, because it's magic and magic is unreliable, but sometimes it works. And, you know, it brings people back from the dead and things like that! So that also changes things. And it's [a jolt?] to their general healing skills. It's odd though that some of the things that they practiced in the Middle Ages which were later rejected, you know, like leeches and maggots, are coming back! *laughs* Cause it turns out that they knew more than we thought they did, and that, you know, maggots actually can perform a function.

Q: [...] You mentioned Charles XII and all the other Swedish kings and if I recall correctly you mentioned you have read Scandinavian history at college?
GRRM: Yes, gust a general course though.
Q: But you wrote a short story that was later published as "The Siege" I think - about a critical event in Swedish history, forgotten mostly, about the fall of Sveaborg, Gibraltar of the North. If you can tell us something of why you wrote that and what the story entailed? Because I guess most people here don't know about Sveaborg.

GRRM: Yes, I wrote that my sophomore year of college at Northwestern University, so I was, you know, 18 years old or something like that. I was taking a course in Scandinavian history, general survey course. And we were assigned to do a term paper. But in those days, you know, I was taking course in creative writing, I was trying to sell stories, I was selling outr science fiction stories and stuff for the magazines. Also writing non-science-fiction stories and trying to sell those. And whenever I took a course, I would try to convince the professor to let me write a short story instead of a term paper. So I went to that professor in Scandinavian history and said "Hey, how about I do fiction, historical fiction?" And he said "Sure!". So I wrote a story about the surrender of Sveaborg and the Russia-Swedish War of 1808. 'Cause it was a great historical mystery that I've come across during the survey course, and I've read Runeberg's poem about it, or the English translation [thereof?], and it seemed like a fascinating subject. And hey, I got an A on the paper, and that was pretty good. And twenty years later I rewrote the story, and I added a time-travelling dwarf, and sold it to 'Omni' and got thousands of dollars. So it worked out pretty well! The original story had no time-travelling dwarf [in that war?]. *laughs*

Q: So far in the story, you've kept expanding the world - character by character, location by location. And you just told us about this. A lot of places that you've introduced that we won't revisit as readers. But are there characters that we haven't been inside the head of as of yet that we will come to know in the point of view? You may be, again, as vague as you want [...]

GRRM: My plan is no. Except of course for the prologues and epilogues where, as you know, you usually get into viewpoint of a different point-of-view character for one chapter. However that is subject to change. As I write the books I encounter problems and sometimes I find that I need a new point of view in order to make it work. I mean, those of you who follow discussions at conventions and other interviews and some of the things I post on my blog will know that-- with the last book I had a particular trouble, with what I called the Meereenese knot, with a number of characters arriving in Meereen. And I had a bunch of viewpoint characters there. Already I had Quentyn Martell turning up, I had, you know, Tyrion turning up, I had Dany there. And I kept, you know, reworking these chapters and rewriting from different point of view and reordering who arrived first and what happened first and what happened second. And I could never really make the pieces fit to make them sort of flow the way I wanted to. Until I finally said "I'm gonna give Ser Barristan a viewpoint. He's the one I need there to make it work, make the post-Dany stuff work. You know, make it... Tyrion-- 'cause Tyrion didn't even speak the language; it was very difficult to write these scenes where Tyrion was the viewpoint character and he didn't know what the fuck anybody was saying! *laughs* So, but having Ser Barristan there suddenly made those things work. And, you know, I may find that is necessary again, we'll see. But hopefully it won't be, 'cause I actually like to, you know, as you say the story has been going further and further out, but it's past time that the story turned to sort of coming together, and that's certainly my overall plan, and that's what I'm working on right now. But... fewer viewpoint characters not more, but I'm not gonna make a pledge in blood.

Q: I know you probably can't tell me, but [...] Petyr Baelish [...] is it possible that he's a Reyne or a Tarbeck?

GRRM: Wow. I don't know, I suppose anything is possible, but his history is fairly explicit. Is this a theory you've heard before?
EG: There are many theories out there. Obviously we have his history stated in the books. His great-grand-father was from Braavos and-- Obvious fakes. I can't tell anything more than George can, so let's pass.

Q: 1) [any plans for character reunions like Bran & Arya?] [Мартин не расслышал вопрос, просил повторить] 2) [where do you take ideas of religions?] If you ever take ideas from ancient cultures.

GRRM: Sure! They're all at least partly inspired by real religions. You know, the Faith in the Seven is medieval Catholicism with some fantasy twists, the Old Gods is Druidism or Animism or some of the more primitive religions, the... [preferrably, one of more interesting things?] is the Red God which is Zoroastrism and the Cathar heresy, the so-called Albigensian heresy that swept Europe in-- I believe it was the 1100s or 1200s... provoked the Albigensian Crusade. That was a fascinating group of heretics. They claimed to be Christian heretics, but their philosophy was so far removed from Christianity that it was barely qualified, and-- fascinating story, the Albigensian Crusade.
EG: [...] The Drowned God is, of course, our Lord and Savior - Cthulhu! [...]

EG: You took a Scandinavian history course in college. Was that just to fill credits or were you-- just something about Scandinavia - interested you? I mean here you are, in the Royal Armory of Sweden.

GRRM: What interested me was the fact that I knew nothing about it. I don't know what kind of history you're taught here in Sweden, but as a kid in America, growing up at least back when I did, in the 50s and 60s, you get American history, and then you get the course called "Western Civilization". And then you get them over and over again. You start in grade school and you get, you know... British colonists, Jamestown, Plymouth Rock, American Revolution, George Washington, Andrew Jackson, ooh here comes the Civil War, Abraham Lincoln etcetera. And then you get-- in the next year, then you get the world history. You know, the Egyptians, and then the Greeks, and then the Romans, and Battle of Marathon, and memorising the dates, and then you go forward and you get the Crusades and the Middle Ages... well, the Roman Empire, and the Dark Ages, then the Middle Ages and all of that stuff. And you follow England mostly. And then you go on to, like, high school, and you get the same subjects, but just in more detail, you know. Then they tell you all the stuff they taught you in grade school was not actually true. You know, George Washington didn't chop down the cherry tree, and he wasn't standing up when they crossed to Trenton in the boat and all that stuff. So first you get the myths and then you get a little more realistic. And then you reach college, and you get the same subjects taught over again! But! In college you also have electives where you can take-- and history was my minor. So I said "I don't want to hear anymore about the Romans or the Greeks or the Battle of Marathon or the Battle of Hastings - I know all that shit, I've been over it like 4 times already. What's that something about Scandinavian, I don't know nothing about them, you know? I know I saw 'The Vikings' once and... *laughs* that seemed sort of interesting so I'll study that. I also took courses in Chinese history and, you know, other exotic courses that covered histories that I'd never previously studied. Of course I found all that fascinating.

Q: [...] I like reading your Not-A-Blog, and you have so many interesting and fun projects going on. And I'm wondering, like, how many projects do you have, and where do you find the time to rest? Do you rest?

GRRM: I have a lot of projects. Maybe too many projects, I don't know. Every time I announce a new one I get angry fans who write "Why are you doing something else as you should be doing Winds of Winter?" I have an overall deal with HBO, which means that they pay me vast sums of money, entirely aside from the vast sums of money they're paying me for Game of Thrones... They pay me other vast sums of money to invent new shows for them. So I invent ideas, and sometimes they say "Nah, we don't like that." But other times they say "Oh, that's good". And then we go out and we develop the idea and we hire a writer and we write a pilot, so, you know, and if they like the pilot they make the pilot, and if they like what they make then you have a new show on the air and I have like three projects like that that I've invented as a part of my overall deal that are on various stages of development. Will any of them actually become television shows? I got no clue, you know. It's a crapshoot. I mean, in the 1990s I spent 5 years in development, working for Columbia Pictures, and developing pilots for ABC and the Fox Network. And I wrote-- some I thought were good scripts, good shows, but [notary member wiped all away???]. It's, you know-- many pilots are made and things are done. I've got my Wild Cards series which I've been editing for, you know, decades now, it goes back longer than Ice and Fire, it's still ongoing. And other things come my way, you know. They seem like fun, so I work on them. But one thing that almost all of these other projects have in common is that I'm not doing the writing. Or I'm doing a little bit of the writing, but somebody else is doing most of the writing. They may be based on an old script that I wrote a long time ago, they may be based on a short story... For example, we are developing The Skin Trade, my novella that I published-- I believe it was 1987-- as a potential television series. I wrote the novella, but other people are writing the pilot script. So if it goes forward... It's the same trick of course I use with Elio and Linda - is bring other people aboard and get them to do most of the work. And, you know, that works, works very well. Although I wound up-- somehow you turned that on me and I wound up doing a helluva lot of the work anyway. *laughs* So... You know, I like making stuff up, what can I say. I've been telling stories since I was a kid. And these new projects are exciting, I [hate to ever?] think I was just like doing one thing over and over. And, you know, I hope some of you guys and some of the other readers out there enjoy the other projects as well as I know you love Westeros and you love Ice and Fire. And I do too, but I also love my other children. And I realized that I was popular, and I hope I never arrive-- I mean I knew Frank Herbert a little. No, he wasn't a close friend or anyting, but I met him a little in last few years of his life. And Frank had actually come to kinda hate Dune by the end, because that was all anybody wanted from him. And he really wanted to write the other novels he wanted to write, other worlds and characters he wanted to create. And his publishers and his fans were just saying "No, we don't care about that, just give us another Dune novel. Okay, thanks for that one, give us another Dune novel. Okay, that was good, give us another Dune novel". And I hope I never wind up in that situation. Of course I don't have to because, you know, I'm doing well enough so that when I finish Ice and Fire I can write pretty much anything I want, and if it only sells 3000 copies I won't give a crap. *laughs* But I hope it won't. And actually I don't think-- even when I finish Ice and Fire I-- this story will be finished, but I don't think I'll ever be finished with the world. Obviously, I have to finish my sidebars and publish those as the history of the Targaryen dynasty, 'Fire and Blood'. And then I have more Dunk and Egg stories to write. I've only got maybe a third of the way through their careers. And then I-- who knows, maybe I'll write a whole series of things set in Yi Ti, exploring some of the history that I put there. That's the great thing about creating a world - it's you have a world to play in, not just a particular set of characters.

Буду рад, если кто-нибудь из команды переведет или перескажет для новостей - теперь это несложно :) Как по мне, беседа получилась очень интересной.
О чем говорили: о королях и сыре, о правилах кайвассы, о СанСане и синдроме Бобы Фетта, о спорах с Шекспиром и Толкином, о картах Вестероса в книгах и сериале, о цитатах из Лавкрафта и многом другом.


Так сказано многое, но интересного, на мой взгляд мало. Пересказ.
О - Мой самый нелюбимый вопрос "кто будет дописывать ПЛИО, когда вы умрете"? Я не собираюсь умирать, я надеюсь жить вечно.
В - Пир и Танец были разделены по географическому принципу. Как вы планируете управиться со всеми этими добавочными ПОВами, не планируете ли вы сократить некоторые линии?
О - Ну, я еще ничего не закончил так что кто знает, что будет в конце, но я не планирую ничего сокращать. Так же я не планирую разделять книгу на две части.
В - Не получится ли так, что у зрителей сериала будет преимущество перед читателями?
О - Мартин рассуждает об эффекте бабочки, и о том, что без малого двадцать персонажей в сериале умерли, хотя в книге они все еще живы. К тому же имеется много персонажей, которые даже не существуют в сериале. Все это будет порождать большие различия. Вы можете увидеть весьма шокирующие вещи в следующем сезоне, но вы не можете быть уверены, что это спойлеры. Это события никогда не случатся в книге, потому что книга и сериал идут разными дорогами.
В - Насколько велики медицинские познания Мейстеров.
О - Я изначально обдумано решил, что уровень медицинских знаний в Вестеросе, будет выше, чем в реальном средневековье. В основном потому, что не хотел, чтобы персонажи умирали в 26. Мейстеры улучшили стандарты гигиены и они лучше разбираются в некоторых практических вопросах. А еще у них есть магия. Которая не всегда работает, потому что магия ненадежна, но иногда она работает.
В - На протяжении истории вы продолжали увеличивать размер мира, персонаж за персонажем, локация за локацией. Сколько новых ПОВов вы собираетесь ввести или, возможно, вернуть кого-то из старых?
О - Больше не планирую. За исключением, конечно, пролога и эпилога. История движется в направлении концентрации, и это определенно план, согласно которому я теперь работаю. Но... возможно несколько ПОВов, не больше, но я не стану клясться в этом на крови.
В - Откуда вы берете идеи для своих религий?
О - Вера в Семерых это средневековый католицизм с некоторыми фантастическими элементами. Старые боги это друидизм и аннимизм, возможно некоторые более примитивные культы. Красный бог это зороастризм плюс катарская ересь, известная как альбигойство. История альбигойских крестовых походов весьма увлекательная.
Элио - Утонувший бог это Ктулху.
В - Согласно не-блогу у вас много интересных проектов. Есть ли у вас время отдыхать?
О - Да, у меня много проектов, возможно, слишком много. Каждый раз, когда я объявляю о новом фанаты недовольны. Но я надеюсь многие из вас будут получать от них такое же удовольствие, как от ПЛИО. Надеюсь не повторить судьбу Френка Герберта от которого хотели только продолжения Дюны. Впрочем, даже когда я закончу ПЛИО я не закончу с Вестеросом.


На мой взгляд, самое интересное там было про географию. Полупересказ-полуперевод:

Вот из-за таких историй книжки и задерживаются. Звонит мне, значит, издатель: "Хотим выпустить книгу карт ["Земли льда и пламени"]. Вам ничего делать не надо, только денежки считать, карты-то уже готовы". Я такой: "Ещё бы! Несите денежки". Несут. Через пару месяцев звонят: "Чой-та мы тут карты из книг увеличили, а там столько пустого места..."

Сижу, значит, сочиняю горы, реки, города. А там же думать надо, что куда течет и что как называется. В фэнтези иногда просто интернет-генераторы имён врубают - такой бред получается! Ладно, думаю, горы. Пусть будут Туманные горы. Стоп, это же у Толкина было. Тогда Скалистые. Ай, чёрт, такие в реале есть. Заострённые? Да ну, вообще тупо... И так всю дорогу. Ладно, сделал Север и Юг - но есть же ещё Эссос! А там вообще было пусто. Сел, придумал. А на самом краю мира у меня город Кварт, восточнее даже Дени не ходила. Вот только в книге есть сцена, где Ксаро Ксоан Даксос дарит ей гобелен с картой мира. А там Кварт в центре. То есть по идее к востоку от Кварта ещё должно быть ещё столько же! И вот издатель такой: "А на востоке-то что? А то читатели интересуются!" Приходится рисовать. Самое забавное, что примерную карту тех мест я уже к тому моменту послал HBO. А теперь решил всё к востоку от Кварта вообще переделать с нуля. Так что теперь сериал противоречит книгам даже на уровне элементарной географии!

Но когда я придумывал, что там к востоку от Кварта, у меня уже совсем фантазия на названия кончилась. Я начал вставлять отсылки. Сделал город "Carcosa" - решил, что такую малоизвестную штуку никто не просечёт. Кто ж знал, что пару лет спустя эту хрень распиарит "Настоящий детектив"! Потом добавил "K'Dath" около Серой пустоши. Это всё отсылки к Лавкрафту - всё равно, думаю, герои дотуда не доберутся, пусть фанатам будет радость.

(Элио: Ага, нам-то была радость, только потом нас засыпали вопросами: "Вааау, Джордж заранее знал про Настоящего детектива?" А это вообще Роберт Чамберс ещё до Лавкрафта придумал.)

...Ладно, карты я сдал и забыл, всё вроде хорошо. И тут на меня сваливается "Мир Льда и пламени"! И начинается: "Нам нужна история И-Ти! Что известно про Джогос Най?" И вот я уже пишу целые статьи по названиям, которые впихнул только ради карты - и всё из-за той строчки про гобелен! Зато весело, затягивает. Можно же написать и историю И-Ти с кучей цветных императоров, и историю Ленга (это я тоже спёр у Лавкрафта)... Помните: когда воруешь у одного предшественника - это плагиат, а когда у многих - это уже сбор материала.


Пока мы тут ждем Ветра Зимы, Джорджа Мартина убили,

К счастью, Не по настоящему, а всего лишь в фильме Sharknado3.
А на камео в Игре Престолов у него, значит, времени нет, да!?
Последнее редактирование:




Я в первую очередь подумала, что на Мартина напали фанаты.
Псс, мне показалось, или акула была трехглавой? Неужто отсылка к Таргариенам?


Казненный браконьер
В зрелом возрасте Мартин наконец-то стал писать настоящее фэнтези, не маскируя его под НФ(как раньше. Все эти "призраки", "оборотни", "баньши", "Моргана"...:sneaky::devil laugh:)
И это его фэнтези намного сложнее, тоньше и значительнее его же НФ.:cool::cool:

moral rat

Межевой рыцарь
Из паблика Пестряка. Надеюсь, еще не было...

AngryGoTFan в своем твиттере оставлял онлайн заметки о встрече фанатов с Мартином. Джордж зачитал главу Барристана о битве под Миэрином, немного посетовал на то, что бюджет сериала это не потянул, а затем отвечал на вопросы собравшихся фанатов.

Итак, самое интересное (все это из уст Мартина, если че).

1) Джордж не особо доволен сериалом.
2) Сериальный Тирион совсем не похож на книжного.
3) Джордж пишет свои книги (обе, в т.ч. Грезы) в настоящее время.
4) Не каждая мелкая деталь имеет значение. Большинство теорий ошибочны, потому что фанаты уделяют слишком много значения простым словам.
5) Мартин собирается писать сагу до самой своей смерти.
6) Магия в Вестеросе не имеет четкой системы.
7) HBO буквально заставил Джорджа посещать церемонии Эмми.
8) В мире ПЛиО есть живые динозавры, но где-то далеко.
9) Джодж знает, кто будет сидеть на Железном Троне в самом конце.
10) Мартин не собирается что-то менять в уже написанных книгах.
11) Вырезанного материала уже сейчас хватило бы на целую книгу.
12) Когда Джордж пишет книги, он представляет себе книжных персонажей, а не актеров сериала.

И самое интересное.


Погибшие в сериале персонажи будут живы до конца саги в книгах. [Прим. - Полагаю, речь лишь о некоторых из них.]